Museveni backing reactionary force – Machar spokesperson

What brings you to Uganda?
I am in Uganda under the special arrangement, the Kampala Outcome of the August 21, 2014. You know very well we (Riek Machar camp) have had a very difficult relationship with the government here because of its intervention in the matters of South Sudan. But at the end of it all, we said we need to talk and keep every door open. So I am here as a guest of State of the Republic of Uganda; we are here to see how we can bring that senseless conflict in our country to a conclusive end.

Explain more about your opposition to UPDF’s presence in South Sudan
I want to make this very clear. We are opposed to the presence of the UPDF in South Sudan because president Salva Kiir is abusing it to legitimise illegality; the abuse of the rights of the people of South Sudan. We shall always remain indebted for the support that we received from this great country Uganda during our liberation struggle. President Museveni stood by the people of South Sudan. He is the only leader in the region who came out to openly condemn Arab chauvinism, the dictatorship from Khartoum.
President Museveni believes that South Sudanese people deserve the best; that is why he stood with us, he gave us the ground. Most of our leadership has been here, I was here myself during the struggle. He gave us free passage and concealment; many of our goods passed here. Many people condemned him but he never stopped because he believed in the pan-African agenda. He believes that Africans deserve the best.
So President Museveni invited us, saying he needed to also talk to the SPLM in opposition. This was despite the fact that Juba continued to front false intelligence narratives, claiming that if Dr Machar takes over in Juba, he would ally with Khartoum and LRA to destabilise Uganda. But President Museveni recognised that there are mistakes in Juba and he invited us to have a dialogue much as Juba has been putting unnecessary pressure on the government here to expel us.

How come Dr Machar hasn’t visited President Museveni yet?
The two have been meeting. You should know that President Museveni has not missed any of the Igad [Intergovernmental Authority on Development mediation] meetings in Addis Ababa. The two have been meeting there, much as it is not yet very formal. We have been pursuing a meeting with the two here, but there has been trouble with schedules. But Dr Machar is looking forward to a meeting with President Museveni because President Museveni is the elder statesman within the region and his leadership is very important.
The reason the talks in Addis have been very clumsy is because they miss a touch like his and the active involvement of Uganda in South Sudan has compounded the crisis of leadership. We need the leadership of President Museveni in the talks. So what we are saying to the leadership of Uganda is that please withdraw so that we can benefit from President Museveni’s visionary leadership.

Some say Dr Machar is incapable of building alliances...
That is not correct. Comrade chairman Dr Machar has been making rounds within the region. We are okay with the government in Kenya, you should know that he has visited Kenya for about three times now and his family is resident there. He has been part of the Arusha initiative, so he has been to Tanzania, and he has been to South Africa. He has been to Khartoum, and currently he is resident in Ethiopia.
When we held a discussion in Pagak and many people poured many anti-Uganda sentiments, Dr Machar made it clear that let emotions not cloud the judgement of members of the SPLM in opposition. He called on them to see the good part of President Museveni. South Sudan is what it is today in a large part because of the contribution of President Museveni. He made that very clear to the leadership.

There is talk about 1991 when Dr Machar sided with Khartoum
South Sudan is a result of the 1991 disagreement with Dr John Garang. They disagreed on principle, on the issues relating to the way the Movement was being run. It was in Addis that Dr Machar and some other members of the SPLM questioned the way the Movement was being run by our former hero Dr John Garang.
You know Dr Garang was running the Movement as one man and Dr Machar opposed it. He said there was a way to improve things. He said we were fighting a dictatorship in Khartoum and there is no way we would also have a dictatorship in the bush. He was a volunteer like everyone else. He had joined the struggle after completing his PhD at 30 years.
So Garang took it personal and feared that there were people who wanted to take over the Movement. He issued a warrant of arrest against Dr Machar, Dr Lam Akol and the group to be arrested. Even if it were you and someone wants to arrest you under such a situation, how would you respond?
So Dr Machar and the other groups decided to form their own Movement, the South Sudan Independent Movement. Dr Machar made it clear that they were not going to fight for a united Sudan but Dr Garang had wanted us to fight for a united Sudan. Dr Machar came up with what was called the Nasir Declaration, which envisioned a united Sudan. So the birth of South Sudan in 2011 was the realisation of the vision of Dr Machar. Even President Museveni who is one of my heroes has disagreed with people too. So what is wrong with disagreement? People can disagree. In fact, 1991 repeated itself in 2004 when Comrade Salva Kiir disagreed with Dr Garang and he almost defected. He was in jail.
In 2004 during the Rumbek conference it was Dr Machar who reconciled Dr Garang with president Kiir. The same thing repeated itself in 2013 and led to the current conflict. You see, Gautama Buddha, the founder of Buddhism, said there are three things which cannot be hidden – the sun, the moon and the truth. If you don’t address the issue it will keep manifesting. We need to address the structural issues affecting the running of the party and the country.

Isn’t 10 years too short a time for a leader to turn around South Sudan?
I appreciate that there are challenges. But when we came from the bush, we inherited the oil boom. But what did we do with the money? It was stolen. President Museveni told us in December that he is very disappointed with the leaders of South Sudan and they need to be court-martialed because they have betrayed the people of South Sudan and all the people who supported them. So President Kiir needs to be court-martialed.

Was independence for South Sudan a good idea, you think?
Independence for South Sudan was the best idea ever. We can’t regret it. What has failed us is the leadership. We recognise, however, that we have to engage Khartoum. Our border is still not demarcated, we have the contested issue of Abyei, and we have an oil pipeline running to Khartoum. That is why we are engaging them.
We have railway links we share, we have issues of intermarriage that have to be managed. We are talking to them because we are a viable alternative that will take power in Juba eventually. We need to engage them. The difference with us is that we talk to Khartoum and Kampala during the day while president Kiir talks to Kampala during the day and then talks to Khartoum during the night.

You have referred to the talk that Dr Machar backs Kony’s LRA ...
Dr Machar is fighting for reform in South Sudan. He does not claim to have any moral obligation to want to change the government in Kampala. He hosted the LRA mediation between LRA and the Uganda government because he wanted peace to return to Uganda. He wanted peace in Uganda because Uganda is our strategic ally. He worked hard to ensure the success of the talks between LRA and the government here. He wanted to present the resolution of the LRA conflict as a trophy given the fact that people had earlier associated him with LRA.
But the reactionary forces in Juba, Khartoum, and elsewhere worked so hard to fail the peace process. But the LRA have been incapacitated anyway. In fact, the weak state in Juba is lucrative ground for the LRA to return.

Just how weak is the Juba government?
President Kiir thinks that he has a right to be kept in power by the UPDF indefinitely and in the process he is spoiling the legacy of President Museveni. President Kiir believes in reactionary, sectarian ideology; the ideology of the regimes President Museveni opposed here.
It’s a paradox to see a disciplined, progressive Force from Uganda supporting such a reactionary regime that has been rejected by the entire international community. Kiir is giving a lot of unnecessary burden to President Museveni. President Museveni needs to say ‘don’t confuse me, I am a progressive leader, sort out yourself.’

What is the way forward?
Comrade Salva Kiir should realise that he has no capacity to lead us forward. He should step aside. We are going to discuss about his future.